I lived at 10,600 feet for 6.5 weeks last summer, coming from essentially sea level.
I felt like I was adjusted 90% adjusted about 2 weeks in, like I could walk at a normal speed. My Garmin watch agreed with this adaption. However, trying to mountain bike with the locals was hilarious... even at week 6 I barely started to be able to keep up on climbs. I rode my mountain bike nearly every day, or at minimum took a several mile hike
Near the end I had a bender with some coworkers. I started developing a persistent "altitude" cough after that that never really went away until I got back down to sea level. The cough disappeared in 36 hours. And wow, did I feel like superman when I got back racing my peers.
Did you catch the important point in my story though? I live an active life style at sea level, but man, people living in small towns in the mountains _love_ the outdoors. We were active every day of the week: riding, hiking, climbing, etc. I could definitely see how altitude helps with cardiovascular health, but it's already been proven that leading an active lifestyle is one of the most amazing things you can do for your health and happiness.
Mountains are objectively aesthetically pleasing to humans. They also retain the most wild and specific nature around, especially in western world where in the past mostly agriculture changed environment forever. You can find entire states in Europe where 'wilderness' is basically a well curated park that was a field some time ago. Air is much cleaner, you see far and you feel utterly insignificant up there.
Mountains also allow tons of various sports most of the year as you mention and attract such crowds.
Overall, people go in droves to mountains every year, summer and winter, to recharge. And its a different recharge compared to some beach holiday, much more active and I dare to say a more effective one (active vacations simply recharge better mental tiredness of modern living and working).
I live near Geneva, Switzerland and after moving here basically became mountain sports addict. Hiking, ferratas, climbing, a bit of alpinism in non-winter, and skiing / ski touring in winter. For exotic places there is diving to keep a bit of balance. Did also some paragliding too but had a nasty accident last year that almost killed me so stopped that. Rest I continue, and will do till the last moment I can still do them, they make me properly happy like a toddler. I live in best possible place in the world for people like me, 1h drive from home and I am right below Mont Blanc, towering almost 4km higher than Chamonix valley.
One drawback as you mention - higher mountains are basically high altitude deserts, snow and ice everywhere but humidity easily below 5% ie in Himalaya. Many folks trying ie Everest didnt get higher than base camp simply due to being often sick up there, amateurs and pros alike.
> Mountains are objectively aesthetically pleasing to humans
Not sure about that. I find them aesthetically pleasing, and probably most people do, but I know at least one person who remains unmoved when looking at mountain scenery. Of course I find that strange, but there it is.
So not sure about the "objectively". Maybe "Mountains are aesthetically pleasing to MOST humans"
When I did a 2 week road trip from Chengdu to lijiang a couple of decades ago, we spent the first two days of the trip just acclimating on the Tibetan plateau at 3000 meters or at the town near siguniang. Then we hit places like daocheng (3500 meters), we drive through passes at 5000 meters, Litang town at 4000 meters (about the height of mt rainier). The biggest problem I had was the lack of vegetables that high, my teeth really got tired of eating judt meat and potatoes. The places were all populated though with Tibetans, they just lived up there as if it was the most normal thing in the world (heck, litang had 60k people living at 4k meters, that seemed crazy to me).
I wonder if they're confusing the cause and effect.
Do people who live above 8k feet not die of heart disease or do people with heart disease find it too difficult to live above 8k feet so only people without heart disease live above 8k feet?
I live at 7200 feet and I know several people who have moved to lower altitudes because it's "too hard to breath" here.
I visited Mexico City a couple weeks ago and it is at 7200 feet. As I got off the plane I was gasping a bit and I woke up 3 or 4 times the first night gasping for air. I didn't have any problems visiting Denver at 5000 feet in years past but I was absolutely feeling it at 7200. I didn't stay long enough to see if I would acclimate as I continued to feel bad and returned home early.
My dad visited Machu Picchu. He was doing poorly and the guides put him on oxygen. They were well prepared for it, as it happens a lot and is not very predictable.
It's at 8,000 feet.
I remember staying overnight at Estes Park, 7500 feet. I got a headache. I didn't try anything strenuous.
I recall reading about Mt Everest climbs. Even on supplemental oxygen, your brain measurably dies a little. No thanks. People who climb it repeatedly are, in my not-so-humble opinion, idiots.
Potentially not even so high as that. You often see 2,500 m (8,500 ft) used as the beginning of "high altitude" - at that point some studies have detected cognitive effects from long-term exposure. (10.1007/s11065-004-8159-4) A lot of research is focused more on ~4,000+ meters though due to the existence of the Tibetan Plateau.
Very asymmetrically, too. There's a (relatively) small impact on cooking grains and pasta and stuff, but even at 5000 ft where I live beans can easily take 2x as long to cook. It's a challenge.
Hmm, is coffee a problem? (some of the extraction depends on temperature, but if water boils before reaching that temperature then the extraction wouldn't work...)
Yes! I like to vacation in the summer at Mammoth Lakes (~8000 ft ~2400m) and coffee is a bit of a problem. I like weak coffee and compensate for altitude by adding more grounds, but it's really not the same.
One can compensate with (steam)pressure and/or duration. Or cold brewing.
In practice I note not that much difference at about 2500m altitute, where my main residence is. French/Aeropress suffices. 100°C isn't necessary. Even only 90°C suffices.
Similar for good Tea. You destroy that with 100°C. Very good Tea should be brewed at 60 to 70°C for greens, blacks more like 70 to 85. Though the hardness/pH of the used water is equally important for them. For coffee not so much.
As a child I lived for two years at ~11k ft (La Paz, Bolivia). I can vouch for the impact of both Acute Mountain Sickness and the sun at that elevation.
> The best defense is to start at 5,000 feet and stay there for 3 days, drinking water like crazy and resting. Then, come up to the higher elevation and give yourself a day or two to adjust. That usually works.
This is crazy to me as I usually only get 1 acclimation night in before going up. I’m curious how people can find their limits / needs?
"Living at high altitude reduces risk of dying from heart disease", but you're litereally locked in your house because the sun takes every chance to fry you. I'm okay with not reducing my risk of dying from heart disease.
I felt like I was adjusted 90% adjusted about 2 weeks in, like I could walk at a normal speed. My Garmin watch agreed with this adaption. However, trying to mountain bike with the locals was hilarious... even at week 6 I barely started to be able to keep up on climbs. I rode my mountain bike nearly every day, or at minimum took a several mile hike
Near the end I had a bender with some coworkers. I started developing a persistent "altitude" cough after that that never really went away until I got back down to sea level. The cough disappeared in 36 hours. And wow, did I feel like superman when I got back racing my peers.
Did you catch the important point in my story though? I live an active life style at sea level, but man, people living in small towns in the mountains _love_ the outdoors. We were active every day of the week: riding, hiking, climbing, etc. I could definitely see how altitude helps with cardiovascular health, but it's already been proven that leading an active lifestyle is one of the most amazing things you can do for your health and happiness.
Mountains also allow tons of various sports most of the year as you mention and attract such crowds.
Overall, people go in droves to mountains every year, summer and winter, to recharge. And its a different recharge compared to some beach holiday, much more active and I dare to say a more effective one (active vacations simply recharge better mental tiredness of modern living and working).
I live near Geneva, Switzerland and after moving here basically became mountain sports addict. Hiking, ferratas, climbing, a bit of alpinism in non-winter, and skiing / ski touring in winter. For exotic places there is diving to keep a bit of balance. Did also some paragliding too but had a nasty accident last year that almost killed me so stopped that. Rest I continue, and will do till the last moment I can still do them, they make me properly happy like a toddler. I live in best possible place in the world for people like me, 1h drive from home and I am right below Mont Blanc, towering almost 4km higher than Chamonix valley.
One drawback as you mention - higher mountains are basically high altitude deserts, snow and ice everywhere but humidity easily below 5% ie in Himalaya. Many folks trying ie Everest didnt get higher than base camp simply due to being often sick up there, amateurs and pros alike.
Not sure about that. I find them aesthetically pleasing, and probably most people do, but I know at least one person who remains unmoved when looking at mountain scenery. Of course I find that strange, but there it is.
So not sure about the "objectively". Maybe "Mountains are aesthetically pleasing to MOST humans"
Do people who live above 8k feet not die of heart disease or do people with heart disease find it too difficult to live above 8k feet so only people without heart disease live above 8k feet?
I live at 7200 feet and I know several people who have moved to lower altitudes because it's "too hard to breath" here.
It's at 8,000 feet.
I remember staying overnight at Estes Park, 7500 feet. I got a headache. I didn't try anything strenuous.
I recall reading about Mt Everest climbs. Even on supplemental oxygen, your brain measurably dies a little. No thanks. People who climb it repeatedly are, in my not-so-humble opinion, idiots.
In practice I note not that much difference at about 2500m altitute, where my main residence is. French/Aeropress suffices. 100°C isn't necessary. Even only 90°C suffices.
Similar for good Tea. You destroy that with 100°C. Very good Tea should be brewed at 60 to 70°C for greens, blacks more like 70 to 85. Though the hardness/pH of the used water is equally important for them. For coffee not so much.
This is crazy to me as I usually only get 1 acclimation night in before going up. I’m curious how people can find their limits / needs?
Wouldn’t be surprised if this were another contributor to less heart disease- so much incentive to get outside and do stuff.